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We're back after a short hiatus (shakes tiny angry fist at the Olympics). Did absence make the heart grow fonder? Let's find out!



THEN: Jack and Mary. The plan to grab Satan. Donatello and Casmodeus. Cas gives Donatello some serious side-eye.

NOW: Jack wakes up in the bunker and hears Sam and Dean talking. Is this happening now, is it a dream, is it a memory, or is it a hallucination? Jack smiles to hear the brothers discussing his return with obvious relief and affection, and that's a big clue, dear boy. Then an alarm goes off and red lights are flashing (and oh, doesn't that give me fond memories of semidemon!Dean and his hammer) and Jack sees smoke coming through the vent in his door. The brothers are trapped in a burning room and Jack is unable to break the door down with his powers. Then the bunker scene goes away and we see what's really going on - Jack is in AU Michael's lair, being force-fed visions by an angel. "Zachariah," says Michael, "these mind games of yours aren't working." Oooh, it's AU Zachariah! I loved Original Flavor Zachariah. Remember when angels were interesting? (sigh) Zachariah insists he'll keep trying, and that Jack can open a huge rift, big enough for an army, if they can just figure out how to make him do it. Zachariah declares that if fear won't break Jack, he knows something that will. Duh duh duuuuhhh!

Title card!

Bunker. Donatello sits at a table with notes and markers and the demon tablet and an empty bucket of chicken wings. He's having lots of problems - visual disturbances, voices, etc. - but Kevin had issues too, so there's no reason to think anything abnormal is going on here. Cas shows up with a plate of eggs and bacon from Sam and Dean, and suspiciously asks him if he's okay. He doesn't seem reassured by Donatello's claim that he's okay and he's making progress.

Back in the kitchen, Dean is plowing through a huge plate of bacon, to Sam's chagrin.

Don't you think you should take it a little easy on the nitrates?

Dude, if bacon's what kills me, then I win.


Ha! It's funny because it's true. Cas shows up to report on Donatello, and to point out that they still need Lucifer's grace and they should be working on that. Dean reminds him that they've got word out to every hunter they know, and I thought we learned earlier this season that telling "every hunter you know" something isn't necessarily a good thing. But Dean's convinced that someone will notice "something Satany," they'll notify the Winchesters, the Winchesters will nab him, and boom, everything will be fine. Which, of course, ignores that they've attempted to nab Satan once already and everything was not fine at all, but hey. Whatever. It's hard not to be optimistic when you've got that much bacon sitting in front of you. (Now I want bacon.)

There's some weird directing going on in this scene - shooting up at Sam, and getting very close to Dean. It's unsettling for some reason.

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Unsettling, but not unattractive.

Cut to Jack on a lovely lakeshore. Cas shows up and tells him humans are going to ruin it, and I can't really argue with that, because chances are, yeah. Jack doesn't understand why, so Cas puts his hands on his face and gives him visions of the awful things humans do, much like Leeloo learning about war in The Fifth Element. Humans can't help themselves, Cas explains, so Jack has to help them. And Cas can guide him. Jack asks the question which is always on my mind, i.e., "what about Sam and Dean?" Cas says they should have accepted Jack instead of teaching him to fear his powers, and gets all demandy, and Jack figures out that he's actually in AU World and this isn't actually Cas. You failed again, Zachariah! Now they're going to do it Michael's way. Which is surely a bad thing.

Back to Donatello, still struggling with the demon tablet. He writes "mix thoroughly," which makes me think the demon tablet might have a nice recipe for devil's food cake. Or deviled eggs. (Heh.) (Also, I want deviled eggs now.) Then he gets an "aha" face and runs down the hall shouting "Eureka!" He bursts into the map room and announces he's finished the translation. To everyone's surprise, this spell doesn't call for archangel grace at all. They actually have most of the ingredients on hand, other than the hearts of Gog and Magog. Who and mahoo? Gog and Magog, Donatello explains, ancient warriors who are sometimes referred to as brothers (is this significant? spoiler alert: no, it's not) and were bound to "a place without a place and a time without a time" by priests. Luckily, the demon tablet tells them how to free Gog and Magog, though it's going to be dangerous. Cas says he'll do it, and Dean says he'll go with him, and Donatello says sure, he and Sam will stay behind and assemble the rest of the ingredients and you know what that means, friends. It means we'll follow the Dean and Cas show and anything Sam does will happen off-camera.

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So let's enjoy him while he's on camera. I like his new shirt.

Cut to Jack being dragged through Michael's lair and tossed into a cell, where he looks up to see Mary Winchester. He explains what's going on, and I'm sorry, I don't really care enough to write it all out. In fact, when I was watching this the first time, The Husband was telling me that he'd figured out where he recognized Donatello from (the actor was also in The Dark Knight) and I didn't remind him of the no talking during Supernatural rule. That's how invested I was in this scene. So, overview, Mary says they'll kill her to make Jack open the rift, and he needs to not do it, and they find that their cell's warding is weak near the window; weak enough that Jack can get them out.

In the bunker, Dean and Cas are preparing to go wherever they need to go to release Gog and Magog, although no one has said why they can't do it in the bunker. Dean asks how Cas is doing, after everything, and Cas shares that he must have been brought back from the dead for a reason. (Yes, Cas, and the reason is that you were annoying.) He feels like he's let Jack down, and since Michael is coming, maybe Cas was brought back to prepare for war. Dean immediately recognizes that this is not a good thing, cause Cas does some really stupid things in the name of angel war. "We do whatever it takes," Dean says, which once again is probably not a good thought to plant in Cas's head. I mean, Lucifer is walking the earth because Cas thought he had to do "whatever it takes." Think about that, Dean.


He looks nice, though, doesn't he?

They end up in a wooded area. "Field in the middle of nowhere; check," Dean says, so I guess "go to a field in the middle of nowhere" was one of the instructions after all. How oddly specific. Gog and Magog can only be killed by "a weapon touched by God," according to Donatello, so they're using angel blades. (So, all angel blades have been touched by God?) Cas recites something in Enochian that sounds like one of The Husband's passwords (seriously, guys, unless you're married to an IT person, you cannot imagine the passwords I'm expected to remember to get into my own damn bank account). Nothing happens at first, and Dean thinks Cas might have made a mistake, which gets Cas pretty snippy. But then two big (BIG) hulking guys dressed in skins show up. Dean finds them amusing because "they're wearing loincloths," though really it's more like big fur diapers. G&M greet them jovially and ask where their armies are, because whoever releases them has to fight them, and then argue between themselves for a while, and then they have to decide who to kill and one of them says he'll kill "the pretty one" and the other says "they're equally pretty" so the first one says he'll kill "the small one," even though Cas and Dean seem equally small compared to these two, which means he considers Cas the pretty one, and I guess this little adventure is supposed to be funny? It's... eh. Actually just kind of weird.

Gog and Magog attack, and Dean's angel blade is shattered, because apparently G&M's blades were forged by God, which must be more powerful than just being touched by them. (Yet more proof that Chuck really lost interest in things on Earth as time passed.) Dean manages to get his foe's sword and chop his head off, and then he runs it through the guy fighting Cas as he expresses his sadness at killing someone so pretty. "Forged by God, touched by God, same thing," Dean grouses, although clearly this is not the case, Dean. Also, I hope he's keeping that sword. It was forged by God, you know.

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They are NOT equally pretty in my opinion.

However, when Cas opens one of the victims to look for his heart, it turns out he's "a primitive beast formed of rock and sand." Not human, no heart. They're useless.

Meanwhile, Donatello and Sam are gathering the ingredients they need. Donatello is full of weird looks and suspicious behavior, and when Sam's phone buzzes with a call from Dean, Donatello declines the call. Then he picks up a bottle and whacks Sam in the back of the head, and the last thing we see is a Sam's-eye-view of Donatello rearing back and striking him again. Not in the face, Donatello!

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Sam's throat on display, Sam's hair in his face. You're welcome.

Back in AU Land, Michael is very unhappy to find Jack and Mary gone. He instructs Zachariah to find them and kill her in front of Jack. We see Jack and Mary trudging through the barren landscape, where they're eventually discovered by (to no one's surprise, I'm sure) AU Bobby. Glad to see you made it to S13, Jim Beaver! Bobby's shocked to find "Mary Campbell" and "Just Jack, a friend of the family, not a nephilim or anything." He takes them back to his compound. There's a guy with Bobby who I fleetingly hope is going to be AU Rufus, but I am denied. I'm going to get out of order here and stick with this part of the story. Bobby's compound has a lot of children around for some reason - why are there not many women, but lots of kids? Many of the people are wounded, and Bobby tells Jack that angels did it. And that a couple of days ago, 400 people were killed in San Antonio.

(Sidebar: Where do we think Bobby's compound is? At first I thought it correlated with the rift on our side, which would mean it was the Pacific Northwest, but the only places they've mentioned are San Antonio and Abilene, so he seems to be in Texas. And it's not like they've got a good communications network, so Bobby would have to be pretty close to San Antonio to know what was happening there.)

Mary warns Bobby that Michael will be looking for them, and he says not to worry because they've got lookouts and wardings. I bet San Antonio had that too, Bobby. Just saying. Later, Jack amuses the children by making shadow puppets, and I don't know how many of these kids have even seen a dog or an eagle, but they're highly entertained. Bobby brings Mary a drink and talks more about Mary Campbell, who he was obviously half (or maybe three-quarters) in love with. Hey, can our Mary just stay here with AU Bobby? I'd like that. Turns out Mary Campbell had refused to make a demon deal to bring John Winchester back to life, and thus Mary figures out that by making her deal and giving birth to her sons, she actually prevented the apocalypse in her own world. Oh good. Now she doesn't have to feel guilty about basically selling Sam's soul. Bobby tells her that Sam and Dean offered to bring him back, but he is all AU World has, and he can't leave it. Hmm. What are they setting up here?

Jack's shadow puppets get more and more elaborate - he's obviously using his powers. Bobby asks if he's a witch, and Mary, lost in the warm fuzzies, confesses that he's a nephilim. Bobby promptly freaks out, because all angels are bad. Well, that's odd. In 12.23, he immediately recognized that Cas wasn't a bad angel, and even helped him. But you know how it is. Sometimes the Continuity Fairy gives you a gift, and sometimes she poops on you as she flies overhead. Bobby tells her that Jack can't stay with them, and she says she'll leave with him. And he's all, fine, but you know he's gonna turn on you. Duh duh duuuuh!

The next morning, Mary tells Jack they have to leave, but they're interrupted by an alarm. A fireball lands close to them and a cluster of angels show up, including Zachariah. Bobby tells Jack it's his fault, because he used his powers. Mary offers to help, and he tells her to round up the kids and get them to safety. Jack wants to come with her, but Bobby snarls that he's done enough, and Mary tells him to just run and hide. Even though that's what she was going to do, so it seems like it would be a good idea for him to go with her. Jack runs off, but he knows the angels are killing people in the compound. Zachariah finds Mary and asks where Jack is. She doesn't tell him, but Jack shows up on his own and uses his powers to destroy Zachariah and several other angels. Bobby witnesses this, and decides Jack is okay after all. Jack says he came back because "Sam and Dean, they wouldn't run, they'd stay and fight." He declares that he has to kill Michael.

Dean and Cas return to the bunker and find things awry. Sam's holding an ice pack to his face, and he tells them about Donatello's freakout. He shows them a video feed from the dungeon, where Donatello is ranting and raving. He explains that he didn't want to hurt Donatello, but he kept attacking him and biting (and we didn't get to see this!) so he locked him up, and oh, Sam, you sweet thing. Of course you didn't knock him unconscious or tie him up, you just put him safely in the dungeon because you are kind-hearted and I love you.

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I want to kiss it and make it all better.

Dean and Cas explain that Gog and Magog were useless, and the whole thing is probably a setup, that Donatello wanted G&M to kill D&C. The brothers go to the dungeon to question him while Cas watches on the laptop, and we get some nice Donatello POV shots that remind me of that one episode with MoC Dean and Sam questioning a demon. Sam tells him he can fight it, because that's what Sam always says (and does, bless him) but Donatello doesn't want to fight it. He asks if the demon tablet did this, and says he wants to help him, he stands there with his bruised face and tries to help the guy who attacked him because that's Sam and I love him.

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I want to be in that chair.

But Donatello just offers to show him some magic. He mutters something and makes a motion with his hand and Sam ignores it but then Dean reaches out to Sam (Dean reaching out to Sam! It is a good thing!) because he suddenly can't breathe. Sam throws Dean's arm over his shoulder and half-carries him out of the dungeon, a scene we've seen in a hundred fanfics finally coming to life. He gets him into the hallway and there is manhandling and such, and a thousand more scenes are acted out. By the time Cas shows up, Dean can breathe again. Cas glares sadly at the fucked-up prophet.

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But I care less about Cas's sad glares and more about this shit right here.

TFW regroups and tries to figure out what could have made Donatello snap. Sam suggests again that it could have been something in the demon tablet, and Cas says no, prophets can handle that stuff. When Dean points out that Kevin was able to handle it, Sam suddenly realizes the difference between them - Donatello doesn't have a soul. Which we know, since we were reminded of it in the Then. Cas is horrified, because it turns out the soul is a filter, "innoculating the prophet against whatever darkness is in the tablet." Oh, souls. What can't they do?

How do they fix it? They can't. Amara ate Donatello's soul, so it can't be retrieved. Sam starts sinking into despair, because now they don't have a plan and you know how Sam feels about having plan. Cas suggests that it might be kindest to end Donatello's suffering, because when he dies, another prophet will appear, but the brothers don't go for that at all. Really, Cas, you should have just told them you wanted to take him to a farm where he could run around and be happy.

Fine, then. Cas stomps off to the dungeon and announces he's doing "what I have to." Oh, Dean. I told you not to put that idea in his head. He locks the door and confronts Donatello. The prophet basically admits that the proper spell ingredients are in his head, and Cas removes his coat, so you know shit's about to get real. "I'm going to do something that I promised I would never do to a human being without their permission," he says. "I'm going to strip the spell from your mind." Donatello says he's absorbed too much power and this might fry them both, and Cas is all, yeah, it might, but oh well. Donatello tries to stop him with a spell but Cas slaps a hand over his mouth and says "I'm not going to let you, or anyone, hurt the people I love. Not again." There are flashy blue eyes and screaming. Then Cas opens the door and we see Donatello, limp in the chair. Sam and Dean are distressed, but Cas just says "I know what we have to do," and leaves them with the unconscious (or dead?) prophet.

Aftermath! As Cas paces, Sam and Dean return to the bunker from... wherever they were. Apparently it was a hospital, because they tell him Donatello is brain dead, and being kept alive by machines. Cas explains that Donatello was a danger to himself and to everyone else, and also that he was working with Asmodeus.

Some people just can't be saved.

Yeah, but who gets to make that choice? You? What exactly gives you the right?

Nothing. I took it. And if I hadn't acted, we would still be sitting around, and talking about what to do next. We would be wasting time. And it's time we don't have, Dean. I told you. War is coming. War. And I did what soldiers do.


Mmm, Dean, let's talk about who gets to decide who is saved and who isn't. Because it seems to me like you've made that choice yourself. Like, a lot. (On second thought, let's not talk about it. Let's move on.)

Cas tells Dean - and I assume he's only talking to Dean, because for the rest of this scene, Dean is in focus and Sam is blurry in the background, not that I'm bitter about that or anything, god no - that he knows the ingredients for the spell. They need the grace of an archangel, a fruit from the tree of life, the seal of Solomon, and the blood of a most holy man.

"This is the only way we win," he says, "and this is the only way we survive. It's like you said, Dean. Whatever it takes."

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Oh, hey, remember when Sam was in focus? Good times.

Dean seems perturbed about this list of ingredients. (Maybe Sam is too. It's hard to tell, with him being out of focus.) The archangel's grace, we already knew, and they know where to get that. The fruit from the tree of life - isn't this the same fruit they needed at the end of S11? The seal of Solomon, which is presumably a specific ring that bears the seal. The blood of a most holy man, which I assume is different from the blood of a righteous man. Mix thoroughly.

So, this episode. Too much mytharc. Not enough Sam. But that describes so many episodes, doesn't it? And it looks like the big showdown might not involve either one of the Winchesters. (Remember back when the show was about two brothers? That was cool.) We're setting Cas up to do some really inappropriate things in the name of winning the war, which isn't anything new. I mean, we've seen his road paved with good intentions before, and we know where it leads. {sigh} Unfortunately, I watched a lot of S2 last week, and the complicated, ensemble cast mytharcs of later seasons really suffer in comparison.

Can we just get a good MotW episode next week? I'd like that.

As always, no spoilers in the comments, including casting info, please!

Date: 2018-03-02 08:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kribban.livejournal.com
How can there be too much mytharc?? It's so obvious you and I are different viewers because I would love a shorter season (8-10 episodes) of nothing but mytharc.

How do they fix it? They can't. Amara ate Donatello's soul, so it can't be retrieved.

Hey, remember when Amara told Dean that the souls she's eaten are still alive inside her? And remember the good terms they parted on? How about some prayer action, huh????

Date: 2018-03-02 08:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
I guess it's more accurate to say I like a GOOD mytharc (see reference to S2) and I just don't think we have one of those right now.

Date: 2018-03-02 09:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kribban.livejournal.com
Fair!

Someone (not me) had an idea for a future incarnation of SPN - a 6-8 episode Netflix season about a single MOTW case. Like The Killing but with monsters. I would love that.

Date: 2018-03-02 11:44 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
{makes grabby hands at this excellent idea}

Date: 2018-03-03 11:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
FROM YOUR FINGERS TO TPTB'S EYES. Or something. (Yeah, this would be AMAZING. With big boy words and everything.)

Date: 2018-03-02 09:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] amberdreams.livejournal.com
I have a new measure for episodes. Remove Cas and see if it makes any difference to the plot. So for this one, replace Cas with Sam for everything except the fingers in the head routine and this would have been 100% better.

Date: 2018-03-02 11:44 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
Mmmmm... so true!

Date: 2018-03-03 01:24 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cassiopeia7.livejournal.com
I can get behind this. You, I like.

Date: 2018-03-03 11:12 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
Holy shit (literally) ... YOU'RE RIGHT.

Date: 2018-03-02 10:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gidgetgal9.livejournal.com
I was disappointed with no AU Rufus as well!

Date: 2018-03-03 12:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gingersnap1224.livejournal.com
AU Rufus would have been perfect, but no, our dreams are dashed.

I agree that Dean and Cas aren't even close to equally pretty.

I think they gave us a hint as to how they are going get rid of Mary without killing her again. She is going to decide to stay (or go back to) AU-land with Bobby.

Date: 2018-03-03 01:29 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cassiopeia7.livejournal.com
Rufus! ♥ Yup, I was hoping that the dude with Bobby was AU Rufus too. Alas, his distinct lack of snarky remarks crushed my hopes flat. :(

Date: 2018-03-03 02:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] borgmama1of5.livejournal.com
It's disappointing when, at the end of the episode, we are facing the same problem we had at the start. The mytharc eps this season have seemed so draggy and accomplish nothing...

Give me more Jack/Sam/Dean interaction...

Date: 2018-03-03 11:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
Well, I'd argue that some would say a few things were "accomplished": Mary and Jack escaped. And Donatello is no longer in the game. (Okay, this isn't so much an accomplishment as a loss of resources. Albeit a compromised resource. Mostly, it was a way to get the character out of the way and make for an excuse to busy Sam while Dean and Cas get to have an adventure. Who, me, bitter? NAAAAW.)

Gimme more Jack, Sam and Dean too. Please and thank you.

Date: 2018-03-03 09:31 am (UTC)
fanspired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanspired
> Cas shares that he must have been brought back from the dead for a reason. (Yes, Cas, and the reason is that you were annoying.)

Although this is literally true, your comment still somehow seems strangely pointed :P

Date: 2018-03-03 12:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
It works on multiple levels. ;)

Date: 2018-03-03 09:46 am (UTC)
fanspired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanspired
> Bobby tells her that Sam and Dean offered to bring him back, but he is all AU World has, and he can't leave it. Hmm. What are they setting up here?

Oh, just another explanation for why Jim Beaver never does a scene with Jensen. You ever notice that? Check out all his scenes he's done in the past few seasons. They're either with Sam, or somehow avoiding the brothers altogether. Ah, but, end of S12, you'll say! And I say, are you sure the shots of Bobby and the shots of Dean weren't filmed separately? (Strokes chin speculatively).

Date: 2018-03-03 12:42 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
Wait. WAIT. Is this a real thing or are you fucking with me? I love a good conspiracy theory! So do we think they don't get along, or do we think they are actually the same person?

Date: 2018-03-03 01:15 pm (UTC)
fanspired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanspired
Ha! There's no conspiracy theory you can't improve on :D

Edited Date: 2018-03-03 01:57 pm (UTC)

Date: 2018-03-03 10:08 am (UTC)
fanspired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanspired
Have to say, this was one of the worst directed episodes, ever. Someone needs to tell this guy that we're here to watch the show, not his distracting camera tricks. Lose the ego, buster!

I'm given to ponder from time to time how far writers are to blame for the scripts we see on our televisions. It was revealed, for instance, that a good deal of material, that focused on Sam's relationship with Lucifer and explored his decision to take the Mark of Cain, was cut from Berens' script for We Happy Few - demonstrating that a reasonably competent writer cam be made to look bad by a director's decisions.

Which leads me to wonder if the weaknesses in this script by Meredith Glynn, another reasonably competent writer, are actually due to bad re-writes from a demonstrably bad director.

Date: 2018-03-03 12:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
Yeah, there were definitely some weird directing decisions, so this could be the case...

Date: 2018-03-03 10:23 pm (UTC)
ext_3572: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com
Hey, do you have a source for what was cut from "We Happy Few"? We know there were cuts (at one point J2 made references to about 10 minutes being cut from all of the last few eps of s11) and I've seen a lot of speculation about what they were, but I haven't ever seen anything definitive that it was stuff with Sam...

Date: 2018-03-03 11:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
I just saw this gif set fly by my tumblr dash and I can't find it now, dern it! The one where Jared talks about Sam's scenes with God getting cut, where God explains why Sam shouldn't be afraid of Lucifer anymore. I'LL FIND THEM IF IT KILLS ME.

Date: 2018-03-03 11:58 pm (UTC)
ext_3572: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com
Oh, please let me know if you find it! I thought I'd seen all the con footage since those eps and I don't remember this -- I remember mention that there was a Sam and God scene written but I thought it was an earlier ep and it sounded like it was cut by the writer before ever being filmed. More details would be welcome! (I want the tell-all story of what was happening in the writer's room and production at the end of s11 and through s12...)

Date: 2018-03-04 03:20 am (UTC)
fanspired: (Default)
From: [personal profile] fanspired
One day I bet there's gonna be a tell-all book about SPN, and it's gonna make for very interesting reading :) Unfortunately I think I just had what Jared said about WHF reported to me. I'm not sure I saw the actual footage. Or maybe I did. I can't quite remember :S

Date: 2018-03-20 10:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
HOT DAMN, I FOUND IT!

It was one of Jared's solo panels at JIBcon 7:

http://sammyhale.tumblr.com/post/144709294157/jared-jibcon7-saturday-panel


(Can you tell this has been driving me nuts for WEEKS??)

Date: 2018-03-21 03:40 am (UTC)
ext_3572: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com
Ah-hah, thank you! I think I have seen that panel so I just forgot. Though he doesn't say anything about what the cut scenes were specifically about -- obviously scenes with Sam, and the context implies that they concerned Lucifer and/or Chuck, but the idea that it was about taking on the Mark specifically is only speculation (unless there is another source...)

Date: 2018-03-03 08:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] percysowner.livejournal.com
Other continuity question. Cas says they need to find Lucifer. Lucifer just took over Heaven. Cas has told the guys what he has heard on "angel radio" on other episodes, even ones this season. How the heck did he miss the news bulletin about Lucifer TAKING OVER HEAVEN? I mean that's a pretty big thing to miss. Did he decide to switch over to easy listening? Did Lucifer decide to keep his taking over Heaven quiet? Lucifer has never seemed like a keep things quiet type of guy.

The director, P.J.Pence has worked on SPN before he directed

- There's Something About Mary (2017)
- Family Feud (2017)
- Book of the Damned (2015)
- King of the Damned (2014)

I don't remember them being too weirdly directed, although I can't really remember BOTD or KOTD very well.

I was sad about the lack of Sam Meredith Glynn has handled him well before, so his going underground for this episode was unfortunate.

Date: 2018-03-04 12:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
How the heck did he miss the news bulletin about Lucifer TAKING OVER HEAVEN?

Oh, wow. That's a very good question.

Date: 2018-03-03 10:19 pm (UTC)
ext_3572: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com
Hey, can our Mary just stay here with AU Bobby? I'd like that.

Yeah, this is my hope for her (as much as I hope for anything with this show these days, which, not much :P) Though Jack might stick around too, and I wouldn't mind him.

Sometimes the Continuity Fairy gives you a gift, and sometimes she poops on you as she flies overhead

Now I'm picturing less Tinkerbell and more Continuity Seagull, shrieking wildly at everything...

Sam trying to appeal to Donatello emotionally really bugged me, tbh, because while usually I love Sam's empathy and compassion...Donatello is soulless. Sam knows that he's soulless. And he knows what being soulless is like. Why the hell wouldn't he try to appeal to logic rather than feelings he knows Donatello doesn't have? Or did Sam seriously just forget this until they brought it up with Cas? That is a pretty huge thing to forget...(frankly I was confused why they were confused that Donatello wigged out; just about every soulless person seems to, sooner or later, even without a tablet?)

(Remember back when the show was about two brothers? That was cool.)

Yeah. I miss that show a lot. It's really hard to get engaged with where the story is going when it seems like that destination isn't going to involve Sam & Dean in any interesting way...

Also, what was was up with the direction, especially that final scene? I am like half wondering if they somehow just lost the footage with the close-ups on Jared. Especially because Misha was shooting the scene to be talking to both of them (his gaze moves back and forth) -- just weird.

Date: 2018-03-04 12:40 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quickreaver.livejournal.com
Yeah. I miss that show a lot. It's really hard to get engaged with where the story is going when it seems like that destination isn't going to involve Sam & Dean in any interesting way...

Yeeeup. It feels like the New Guard is hellbent on shoving this 'ensemble cast' idea into a show that wasn't created as such. Consequently, those of us who got addicted to SPN for one reason (or two, named Sam and Dean) are left without our fix. Either we accept the johnny-come-latey characters, in the desperate hope we get a hit of our drug of choice every so often, or we leave. (A nearly constant stream of convention teasers doesn't help.)

Okay, that was a little dramatic, but not by much.

Billie the Death insists that Sam and Dean are still important, so she can't condone their reaping yet. Yeah, really? How is that? I've yet to see it. I'll be 200% shocked if Dabb has something concrete planned for that foreshadow.

Date: 2018-03-04 01:04 am (UTC)
ext_3572: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com
Yeeeeeah I don't think Billie was foreshadowing anything. Considering Cas's "cosmic consequences" still haven't come to pass (unless Billie becoming Death was the consequences...but Cas got off scot-free?)

The problem with the ensemble cast is -- putting aside those of us who watch for the brothers and always have -- is that the format of the show doesn't support it. Because most of the cast can only be in a handful of episodes, it really ends up becoming more of an anthology show. This week it was the Cas + the Mary and Jack show. Last week it was the Lucifer and Ketch show. And the Rowena show before that, and the Donna show before that. And unless you love every single one of these characters, you're out of luck a lot of the time; you won't see your favorites, or even get a mention of them, for episodes and episodes.

Date: 2018-03-04 12:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
You know, Donatello's been doing such a good job acting like he has a soul (what did he use? the Mr. Rogers rule?) that I kinda forgot he shouldn't care about people, so I'm gonna give Sam a pass for doing the same thing. ;)

Date: 2018-03-04 03:04 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ex1led-nyer.livejournal.com
My disappointment at having an angel called Zachariah who wasn't Kurt Fuller is immeasurable. Why couldn't they just have called him something else? Then I wouldn't have this deep sense of loss.

Anyhoo, about the only thing I liked about this episode was Jack. That is one irresistible piece of nougat. The Gog and Magog scene was mildly amusing. Bobby was cool. Angels, not so much. Your recaps always make things better, though.

Date: 2018-03-04 12:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caranfindel.livejournal.com
I just watched Wayne's World, and was surprised to see Kurt Fuller in it. It made me miss Original Recipe Zachariah even harder.

Date: 2018-03-05 02:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] madebyme-x.livejournal.com
You hit the nail on the head; not enough Winchesters. And I did wonder if Sam and Dean were supposed to fight the those other brothers, but this was changed for some reason (I mean the pretty one? Really? However Brothers fighting brothers + pretty one comment, I get. The way we got it, didn't make a lick of sense to me.)

I liked the Mary and Jack scenes; there was a definite echo of Sam in those six month old comments, and I think that maybe that was the intentional. Show has been aligning Sam and Jack, and now Mary is growing close to him. But I still want my scene Show; with Sam and Mary actually talking about the deal.

I'm always happy to see Bobby, but yes, I was sure too that that was AU Rufus and felt robbed. ROBBED.

I've said t before but I'll say it again; I don't know why the writers want things to be so busy and complicated with the mytharc. We don't need so many 'baddies' to have a impact. It just makes everything feel messy and gives us less Winchesters.

If Jack goes evil at the end of the season I'm gonna be so darn annoyed.

Date: 2018-03-05 06:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dragonflybeach.livejournal.com
I started writing the fanfic where Mary finds Dean and Sam a new dad in AU land months ago. Maybe I should get a 900 number and become the new Miss Cleo.

TPTB have no idea how badly I need AU!Rufus. And not a gun. Even if he just screams at the angels to get off his lawn. Seriously. Steven Williams lives to play curmudgeons.

Can Kurt Fuller play somebody in AU!Land? I mean, we've established that is an angel vessel. Maybe he could be Hannah. I think I like that. Bald paunchy Hannah. You know, since women are rare but there's a gazillion children running around.

Am I the only one not sorry to see Donatello go? Can we get a better prophet this time? Or maybe we can steal AU!Kevin. You know, the one who's gotten the "You know Sam and Dean Winchester are psychotically, irrationally, erotically codependent on each other, right?" speech from Zachariah? Because that never gets old.

And yes, I absolutely agree with everyone who said we've got too many characters and too many mytharcs going in too many directions. We need to go back to the three original stars of the show - Sam, Dean, and the Impala.





Edited Date: 2018-03-05 06:17 pm (UTC)

Date: 2018-03-05 09:08 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] percysowner.livejournal.com
Sadly, I think they have set it up so there will not be another prophet. Donatello isn't dead, dead, he's only brain dead, so maybe no more prophets until he officially kicks the bucket. I too will miss him. I like the actor who plays him and I liked the character, who decided to live by What Would Mr. Rogers Do.

Date: 2018-03-06 01:16 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kazluvsbooks.livejournal.com

Jared and Jensen (bless their really attractive hearts) really acted their cute butts off in this episode, with what they were given.

My own opinion is, that there is less Sam this Season because the PTB keep giving his scenes and lines as written, to the other characters so they have something to do.
I have been noticing that, as you say, a lot of Sam scenes are off camera, but the ending with Sam totally a blur, is the first time i have noticed that dhe hasn't been at least a little in focus.
Since the end of S12, often when it is scenes of Sam, Dean and Cas, we only see Dean and Cas talking to each other, which must be a showrunner choice, to give the DeanCas fans a tiny tidbit.
I honestly don't mind a few Dean and Cas scenes, but don't make it look like Sam isn't there, when he is..

I laughed out loud at least three times to your comments under the grabs!! SO AWESOME!!!

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